tv All In With Chris Hayes MSNBC June 5, 2013 8:00pm-9:01pm PDT
had a complete double faced attitude towards sex. officially, prostitution was prohibited, according to the may act of 1941, >> the book is "what soldiers do. thank you very much for joining us tonight. chris hayes is up next. good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes and thank you for joining us. coming up tonight, when president obama goes to the rose garden lately, he sure does make news.
today the in your face appointment of susan rice to be his national security adviser. we'll talk about how that's going over. and later, obama's nomination of the district court judges the other day, one comes with an amazing back story, and a mission to fight against injustices such az stop and frisk. i want to begin with marco rubio whom i believe is attempting to pull off a massive heist in broad daylight. i see you marco rubio. i see what you're doing. in case you thought no one was watching, i see what you are trying to pull. you see, there's a reason senator rubio's star is rising in the gop. he's a possible presidential candidate in 2016, perhaps even a favorite. and it's because in many ways marco rubio is just the perfect candidate for what ales the republican party. he's young, telegenic, inspiring back story, very gifted politician, latino her taj, all attributes that greatly assist a
party that is out of touch with the rising national electorate. let's not forget, the republican candidate for president in 2012 lost young people by 24 points and that was nothing compared to what happened with latinos. the party lost latinos by a crushing 44 points. now, to survive beyond the current generation, republican party is going to have to brush back its vocal minority. the tea party base, the constituency that starts and ends the conversation on immigration with how big should we build the fence and how electrified can it be? if there's anyone that can stop the bleeding, marco rubio would seem to be the one that can do it. if that means acting as a power broker for compromise on president obama's most important lej slative goal, so be it. and so far, let's give some credit here, what once seemed completely inconceivable, has very much has been a reality. a bill that made it out of committee and dramatic vote just last month. >> mr. chairman, the votes are
13 yeas. >> it passes. >> but now, marco rubio has pulled a fast one. he's already getting credit for marshalling the bill forward. now he wants to get credit for killing it, too. so yesterday on conservative talk radio, which you probably weren't listening to, marco rubio said the one that he has put his name and face associated to, he said that bill, the one he signed off on, the one he's been pushing all over the place, it needed to strengthen border security. >> if those amendments don't pass, will you yourself support the bill that emerged from judiciary, senator rubio? >> well i think if those amendments don't pass, then i think we've got a bill that isn't going to become law. and i think we're wasting our time, so the answer is no. >> did you hear that? he will vote no on his own bill. why?
turns out rubio's been working with the senator from texas, john cornyn, working for weeks, according to a rubio aide and if this amendment doesn't make it into the bill, well, the bill that he worked on, it's toast. >> it's not going to pass in the house and i think it's going to struggle to pass in the senate. >> suddenly, marco rubio, the saviour to immigration reform, is on the same page with the republican leadership in the horror show that is the house of representatives, where there's absolutely no chance of an immigration bill passing unless the border is essentially covered in lava. >> i think it's very clear that the house will not take the senate bill. there is an effort to improve the senate bill as it moves to the floor, but it has a long way to go from the house perspective. >> as i sit here speaking to you tonight, we very well may be witnessing the end of immigration reform in congress. it's this close. the man who is going to wear the badge of reform on the
republican party is responsible for what could be a fatal blow. and it's because i think marco rubio realized that actually the best possible outcome for his own career is to be the guy that gets credit for trying to fix the party's willful outlook with latinos and gets to go around to all of the republican donors who desperately want this bill while also at the same time being the guy who stuck the shiv in the deal to please the tea party. that is the heist. and what's being stolen is the future of 12 million people who have flesh and blood stakes in the outcome of this immigration bill, whose future depends on the margins and darkness into the daylight of full american citizenship. and while we all pay attention to the irs star trek videos, marco rubio is getting away with this heist and that's not right. it's not right that marco rubio wants to look latino voters in the eyes and said he did everything he could to change an unfair policy while he openly dashes their hopes the minute
they look away. so here's my proposal. let's make sure he can't have it both ways, because we see what you're doing, marco rubio, and it stinks. joining me now is democrat from colorado, co-chair of the new democrat coalition immigration task force. real simple question, congressman. are we seeing the demise of comprehensive immigration reform today? >> chris, you framed it exactly right. you can't have it both ways. i'm still optimistic. i mean, the next hours, the next days are absolutely critical. senator rubio either needs to put up or shut up. at some point the excuses are getting in the way of actual progress. let's see if they can make real changes that we can live with and they can live with or whether this is a simple ploy to stop immigration reform. >> on the simple ploy to stop immigration reform, one of the members -- there's a house version of folks who come together, bipartisan group, you've been involved in a broader conversation on this. the small group negotiating,
raul labrador, a congressman from utah, he himself is a puerto rican, he's been a very outspoken voice. he announced we have learned and confirmed from a congressional source, he is leaving that group. he is walking away from the deal. what does that mean to you about how precarious this is right now? >> well, our small band of eight is now a band of seven. we still have a bipartisan effort to establish a bill in the house. rule labrador and there's been breakdowns on health care. if you're going to have a requirement that immigrants cover themselves, how are you going to do that if you're not making them eligible for the subsidies. so we're trying to find out when they are in the temporary status, until they become full citizens, which is 13 years, how do we deal with them in the con tax of health care? house republicans voted 37 times to repeal obama care, it's hard to have a practical discussion about what you're going to do on the ground.
>> so this is the fundamental question i have for you. you just mentioned that it sounds like the negotiations happening on your side of capitol hill, which is the house, are breaking down over this insistence by republicans that folks on their way to citizenship not qualify for the subsidies of obama care. they are still going to pay taxes and pay social security. just this obama care thing. do you understand that, as a rational obsession with obama care or just a bad faith effort to destroy the bill? >> look, i think people should look at it economically. when people are paying in, paying taxes, they should get the same benefits. you can't have somebody required to have coverage if they can't afford it. the whole thing breaks apart because people won't register and come forward which is the whole purpose of the bill. look, in the coming days, republicans need to put up or shut up. is this an excuse not to do immigration reform or do they have ideas on how to make it better and more workable? we're going to find out in the coming hours and days. >> jared polis, democrat from colorado, thank you for joining
me. >> thank you, chris. joining me now is victoria defrancesco soto and charles pierce. contributing writer to escwire and a staff writer at graph land.com. victoria, i want to start with you. i'm going to jump over and take the marco rubio side which is, look, ma'am, we are trying over here in the senate but these dudes in the house are for real. they hate this stuff. and unless we can make this bill more conservative, they are going to kill it anyway so what do you want from me, poor marco rubio, i'm sweating here. >> the know u know, the argument from marco rubio is, if i want to get to the white house, i essentially need to appeal to both the republican constituency and the general constituency. what we're seeing here is let me tamp down the bill to go to my republican base to get their support and that way when i go to the general electorate, i can also show that i made the effort
and maybe it's not the ideal bill. maybe it's not the bill that, you know, is the best thing for the 12 million latinos but he's going to come out and say, something is better than nothing. and that's the argument that we've seen in the sub terrainian level with republicans. we're putting our best foot forward. we want to recruit latinos into the party so we're going to do something, it may not be the best but it's something. >> something is better than nothing presumes that he wants a something and charlie, what is your read on the politics of this about whether the incentives are aligned for marco rubio to actually want to deal, or for anyone really in republicans in congress to want to deal? i think they wanted a deal the day after election day. i'm not so sure now. >> i think they wanted a deal the day after election day and then everybody once again in the senate stood up and took a look down the hallway and realized what they were dealing with. this is a party where, if there was one rake in the entire state of kansas, this party to step on, basically.
>> okay. but here's my question. if that's the case, if it's the house that's going to be required for killing this, this is my fear, is that a small group of house republicans who are not going to be accountable to a national constituency, they are going to be the ones to kill it and everyone else in the upper echelons, including marco rubio, are going to walk away like they tried their best. my question to you is, will it stick to marco rubio if it fails? >> well, i don't know that it will stick as far out. as the next presidential election. if he wants to try to play this both ways, i wish him as much luck as mitt romney in the health care primaries. mitt romney got beat up pretty badly for the wonderful things he did here in massachusetts. >> and that is, of course, precisely the fear that marco rubio has. here is mitt romney getting to the right of a lot of his opponents in the primary on this
issue in immigration on the primary. listen to how mitt romney sounded on this in the primary. >> the question is, if i were elected and congress were to pass a dream act, would i veto it? and the answer is yes. >> we hired a lawn company to mow our lawn and they had illegal immigrants working there. we said, look, you can't have any illegals working on our property. i'm running for office, for pete's sake. i can't have illegals. almost half of the jobs created in texas were created for illegal immigrants. >> that is an absolute falsehood on its face. >> if you go to the university of texas, if you're an illegal alien, you get an in-state tuition discount. four years of college, a $100,000 discount if you're an illegal alien. >> vicky, this is the same republican base that the house republican caucus is responsible to and that the presidential candidates are going to have to win a primary from. >> it is. and chris, i want to point something out, though, that we've been assuming that the senate is looking to the house
and trying to act accordingly but also let's think about the possibility that the house could act in response to the senate if the senate, especially the gang of eight really stood up, stood firm and said, look, we are going to take charge of this issue and it is going to be one where we fold and latinos, so the house would move. the senate keeps blaming the house. they need to stop that. they need to take their own responsibility and marco rubio has flip-flopped since the beginning. i am not surprised that he is pulling this. in 2010, he ran away from immigration. remember, he came up with the tea party and then just a couple weeks ago he said, oh, things are moving too fast, it's getting too hasty. i don't think we should move forward this fast. and now he has cold feet. >> i agree with you the responsibility. and here's my feeling about this. marco rubio, if this happens, and a deal happens, he will get the credit he deserves. if it doesn't get done, he owns the failure. he cannot pawn it off on some one else.
and what you just said, vicky, is key. if the senate passes this and pressures the house, there's a chance. if it doesn't, he doesn't get to blame it on the house. vicky and charles, thank you both. if you thought john mccain and the benghazi truthers had claimed the political scalp of susan rice, you would be as wrong as they were when the president named her his national security adviser. we'll delve into that next. because she's got other things to stress about. ♪ go to citi.com/simplicity to apply.
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republicans tried to pre-emptively knock susan rice out as secretary of state but president obama appointed her as his next national security adviser. and there's awe huge brewing scandal complete with documents and big names and intrigue, and it's not in washington. it's in yankee stadium. those stories are coming up. ...and last year, she wasn't eating so well. so i recommended boost complete nutritional drink to help her get the nutrition she was missing. and now she drinks it every day.
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if senator mccain and senator graham and others want to go after somebody, they should go after me. and i'm happy to have that discussion with them. but for them to go after the u.n. ambassador who had nothing to do with benghazi and was simply making a presentation based on intelligence that she had received and to besmirch her reputation is outrageous. >> that was the president defending his ambassador to the united nation, susan rice, back in november from a torrent of vicious, constant, brutal attacks led by john mccain and lindsay graham. all for her appearance on some
sunday talk shows in the wake of the attack in benghazi, libya, during which she outlined a set of talking points from intelligence officials on their best assessment at the time of what had just happened in benghazi. those talking points, we later learned, were not prepared by ambassador rice or edited by her in any shape, way, or form. but the attacks against her were so intense that susan rice, who was then widely reported to be a top contender to replace hillary clinton as secretary of state before it was even offered to her. >> out of of the running, susan rice tells us she's withdrawing her name. >> i withdrew my name because i think it's the right thing for the country and for the president. >> this is so dramatic. they are trying to figure out how republicans managed to deny the president his top choice for secretary of state without benefit of a nomination or a hearing.
>> however they managed, republicans did do that. they did pre-emptively knock susan rice out of secretary of state. but today president obama got the last laugh. because today the president announced none other than susan rice has his new national security adviser that does not require confirmation from the senate. john mccain was left with no other recourse and just sputtered around and announced a tweet. obviously i disagree with potus appointment of susan rice as national security adviser. but i'll make every effort to work with her on important issues. yes, he will. because unfortunately, for senator mccain, he has no other choice. joining me now is joan walsh, editor at large for salon and author of the book, "what's the matter with white people, finding our way in the next america." okay. i just have to say, just to hammer this home, susan rice was so screwed on this whole benghazi thing. just to make as -- i mean, she had nothing to do with it. why was she the target? i still don't get it. why did lindsey graham and john mccain -- what do they have against susan rice? >> i don't get it either.
john mccain, that was awesome, calling it passive aggressive, rand paul was aggressive aggressive and accused her again and lied again and said she was responsible for misleading the american people about benghazi. when we got those talking points memos and saw even in the weird abc version and the white house official version, the one thing those versions agreed on was that susan rice had nothing to do with it. her staff either. people said that she deserved an apology and lindsey graham shot back she deserves a subpoena. so they keep it up. i can't help but think it has something to do with her closeness to the president, her being a woman, all of the garbage about her not being very smart, according to senator mccain, and incompetent, according to lindsey graham, has creepy gender and -- >> i just want to say this also and i want to talk about her new position, because it's quite a powerful one. >> yes, it is. >> but also it's not the
craziest thing to me that they were trying to look out for their bro, john kerry, who they have known for a long time, who was in the senate with them, who has served on committees with them. that to me at the end of the day, when john kerry got this, and i'm not saying this to take anything away from john kerry himself, but that also looked like what was going on. >> that's what a secretary of state is supposed to look like and that's what they are used to and i thought about it again today, too, because you have that incredible visual of the president standing there with susan rice and samantha power, two relatively young women, two people you couldn't imagine john mccain and lindsay graham singling out, or mitt romney putting in his administration. there's a powerful symbolism and there's a break with that old boys network. of course, we've had women secretaries of state. john kerry got a little affirmative action to get that position back. so i want to make that clear. >> until this position, which i think is also fascinating about the twists and turns of the susan rice and the ups and downs of her career in this, she's been very promising and
ambitious individual, real washington star for quite some time. she took a real risk by endorsing barack obama very early on and now she ends up in this position which is in some ways more powerful. it's a good argument to be made, in this white house than john kerry himself. >> yeah. she's close to the president already. she's there. she is -- he's traveling the globe and sure she'll do some of that but basically her job is to be at the president's side. >> she briefs him every day. >> every day. she wound up with the most -- they helped give her the more powerful position. i don't know what john kerry thinks about that. i'm sure john kerry is happy with the job he has but she's definitely kept her power, maybe consolidated her power and is the person that the president wants in that role and it's a good day. it's a good day when we saw him appoint three -- >> judges yesterday. >> nominate three judges yesterday and it's a good day that he stuck to his guns and appointed susan rice in the face
of all this. >> and samantha power is being nominated as her replacement. she's going to have a relatively uncontroversial confirmation and she's a journalist and pulitzer prize winner and american -- authored an enpsych low paidic history of genocide and america's roll in it and the president read if and now look wherey where she is. >> she's been a little too pro intervention over the years but she's backtracked and she's brilliant and she'll do a great job. >> it's interesting how the syria conversation will go as we go forward. >> and we don't get to discuss libya -- >> lord knows what susan rice's politics are, because she was never allowed to go through the actual confirmation process where it might be hurt in the process. joan walsh, msnbc analyst, thank you. we're getting used to our institutions failing us but it's becoming a punch line for american success. -- american excess.
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there's a new "wall street journal" nbc poll out today that shows declining faith in this country's institutions. of the ten institution lists on the poll, including the news media, the federal government and the irs, only the military and auto industry got marks over 25% when it came to having a great deal or quite a bit of confidence in these institutions. not having a whole lot of confidence in this country's institutions has been a dominant theme over the past decade and while major league baseball did not show up in the poll, perhaps no institution better represents the breach of trust that people felt about institutions than major league baseball. many of us thought that professional baseball has been done with the steroid era, that it was over, a time when the game was ripe of performance enhancing drug use. that is until last night when cnn broke the news that tony bosch has agreed to fully cooperate with major league
baseball, a crucial development that could lead to player suspensions. and if the suspensions are upheld, they're reporting that the scandal would be the largest in american sports history. bosch operated the now defunk by biogenesis. does this mean that it's been a sham? he reportedly sold to more than a dozen major league ball players. major league baseball is thought to have the most widely rigorous drug-testing program in all of sports. does this mean it's been a sham? richard, i want to start with the impact of this on the game. this seems like such a lose-lose. you get this leaked report, all of these names that are out there. now this cloud of suspicion is back hanging over everyone's head and yet it's unclear whether they are ever going to be able to prove the allegations. what is going on? >> well, i think the message for
major league baseball in this, chris, is that they are going to be relentless in ferreting out cheaters. and it's not just the commissioner's office, it's not just the owners. the players are angry. you'd be surprised at how angry the players are because this one guy is telling me when there's one positive test, it reflects badly on 500 of us. and they're disgusted. they don't want the peer pressure to do it. they don't want the message to be sent that we cheat. it's a terrible message. so for every player that's going to cheat, every player that thinks he's going to cut a corner, and when you have competitive people involved in a sport, you're going to have some people look to cut corners. the message for major league baseball is, we're going to go after you. we're going to go after you hard. if big names are brought down, tough luck. >> let me take the other side of this for a second. you've got a guy who the major league baseball suits, okay, for running this -- operating this clinic on a very novel league -- legal theory, saying you're inducing people to break their employment contract with us.
he has no money. he then decides to turn over documentation and names to major league baseball as a result of this lawsuit. why are we supposed to trust this guy? like what standing does this guy have and at the end of the day you can't prove these allegations, isn't this sullying for everyone, baseball comes away looking like they are vindictive, that they are leaking this to the press and players look like they're all cheaters? >> well, at the end of the day, here's what's going to happen. if you take this to its logical conclusion, we're going to have a room with an arbitrator, ryan braun on one side of the table and tony bosch on the other side of the table and the arbitrator will decide who is right in this. the whole thing comes back to the fact that baseball wants a message that we're not going to tolerate this stuff, we're going to be aggressive, we're going to punish the people. we're going to test. last january baseball became the first sport to have in-season blood test for human growth hormone. are you going to catch everybody? you're never going to do it.
all you can do is have a world-class program and do the best you can. >> the joint testing agreement, i agree. it's really quite impressive. what does this say about the effectiveness of that program if in fact there was cheating going on while it was happening and does the leaking of these names to a reporter, almost certainly coming from major league baseball itself undermine the trust that has been built up to make this testing agreement work? >> you know, my impression, chris, is that the player's association, which for years has fought testing, is now walking in concert with the owners that they want this stuff out and as michael wiener toured camps this spring, he heard time and again from players, look, a 50-game suspension has not been a deterrent enough and the players i know best, like lance berkman and matt holliday and chris carpenter, people like that, they are furious that guys are still trying to cut corners. again, in a competitive sport when you have competitive people, you're always going to have this issue. it's going to be a cat and mouse game between the tester and testee and all you can do is
keep going at it. >> i want to play this bit of sound that hammers home that point from mike schmidt, the nature of being in such a competitive environment. take a look at this. >> what an exciting time for baseball. guys are -- home runs and ridiculous numbers and fans in the ballpark and revenue coming back and the game is back and, man, look how big he got over the winter and, you know, wow. [ laughter ] that's kind of like everybody's attitude. it's really something. this is the future of the game, i guess. >> do you think you would have gotten caught up in something like that? >> most likely. why not? >> he's talking about the huge 1998 home run race and the amazing explosion that happened in what we now call the steroids era. my question to you is, has the game recovered from that bubble
and the bursting of that bubble. because i thought it sort of had and the report last night made me think, man, we are not out of the woods of this yet. >> well, if you mean from a financial standpoint, attendance, revenues going through the roof, there's parity in the game that was never there before. if you're talking about players still cheating, i think and i always thought during the height of the steroid era, there were a few guys at the top but i don't think the reports of 50 or 60% using it. and now i think the percentages are very small because what do you risk when you use? you risk the damage of your reputation. >> right. >> you risk the loss of millions of dollars, all that stuff. >> there's a lot of money on the table. a lot of money. richard justice, mlb.com columnist, thank you very much. we'll be right back with clip three. man: how did i get here? dumb luck? or good decisions? ones i've made. ones we've all made. about marriage. children. money.
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first, i want to share the three most awesomeness things on the internet today. beginning with online jargon that may have reached saturation point. the term is derp, urban dictionary define it is as an ignorant or common reaction is made. derp. back to trey parker and matt stone's 1998 movie basketball. and thanks to the internet derp means gift galore, they are found themselves in a derp war when a blogger basically is derpy. and paul krugman weighed in, moral derpitude, declaring derp is a waste of internet. and derp -- this was derp jump the shark moment. time will tell if derp is officially over. you will know if your mom starts using it in her facebook posts next week. the second most awesomeness thing on the internet today, time to check in with embattled mayor ford.
last week said he was interviewing new staff after several aides quit, looks like he made good on that promise. he tweeted this pick of the new hires. a picture of himself and a staffer who clearly drew the short straw. as for the crack-smoking part of the story, the crack video might be gone. we'll continue to monitor this story. in the meantime, while use this on the update as a shameless to show you all of this rob ford footage once again. and the third awesomeness thing on the internet today, lawmakers, friends, and family gathered today to honor frank lautenberg. on manhattan's upper east side. it was only fitting that a man known for a sense of humor would have a joke told at his funeral. that's where joe biden comes in. chances are, you were at work and cooperate watch his eulogy on c-span. fortunately, a whole slew of reporters and bloggers were not only watching this tribute, they were live tweeting it.
biden in his element, surrounding by jewish and this one, i gave theuling on at strom therm an's funeral, this one's a lot easier. if there's a definition of redundant, i'm it. biden, never make a eulogy or you'll be back at it again and again and again. biden's remarks were well received. you can book him for your next bar mitzvah or next wedding. i mean that literally. you can find all the links on our website. we'll be right back. [ stewart ] this is the kind of food i love to cook.
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includes aspirin, which blocks pain at the site. try the power of bayer back & body. may 8th, 1992, a washington, d.c., public defender named robert wilkins and his family were pulled over after attending a funeral. they were driving on a main artery, that according to local authorities is a main artery for crack cocaine trafficking. the maryland police issued a warning to his officers that predominantly black males were responsible for the trafficking. so the car driven by wilkins cousin was pulled over by a state trooper, who said they were speeding and asked to search the car. wilkins said no. he then identified himself as a public defender and cited supreme court precedent that they could not be held for a dog search without reasonable suspicion they were carrying
drugs. the trooper was not moved and asked them if they had, quote, nothing to hide, then what was the problem? and wilkins and his family were forced to stand on the side of the road in the rain while trooper searched the car and found nothing. robert wilkins will go on to sue the maryland state police department for racial discrimination and win because as he said then, i was determined to do something about this because i don't consider myself a victim. i consider myself a warrior. i wanted to make sure that this stopped happening to other people. wilkins' 1993 lawsuit was the driving while black case, the case that led to an outpouring of similar stories from people all over the country. >> the crime is called dwb, driving while black, a crime committed when an officer racially profiles drivers. pastor curtis mitchell says it happens to members of his congregation. >> i had one of our associate pastors pulled over with his wife and three of his grandchildren in there and the
officer pulled him over and when he pulled him over he said i didn't see your seat belt and then he came up and had all of their seat belts on just because he was black. >> yesterday, that man, now judge robert wilkins, was nominated by president obama to the u.s. court appeals for the d.c. circuit. robert wilkins has spent his life fighting discrimination through the courts and winning and he has just been nominated to the federal bench but the policies he was fighting then, those policies are still very much with us now. they have been established at cities across the family. here in new york, under a policy known as stop and frisk. in new york in 2011, get this, over 168,000 men from the ages of 14 to 24, were stopped on the street and frisked by the nypd. there are 158,000 men living 14 to 24 living in new york city, 106% of black men, from ages 14 to 24 have been stopped and frisked. 106%. the nypd with the unconditional support of mayor michael
bloomberg has stopped and frisked more black men than there are black men in new york city. institutional racial discrimination is alive and well in the united states. a former baltimore police officer, current professor of college of criminal justice and author of the book cop in the hood, which is a great read. and political analyst at georgetown university, great to have you all. michael, what is your -- i think the wilkins story is so incredible and that quote and i'm a warrior, and then to see him, what does that say to you that the president has made that appointment? >> here's a guy who understands what it feels like for the average american but especially in this case african-american male who's been subjected to the arbitrary exercise of power of the state against a vulnerable citizen, and now he occupies the second highest court, or will, should he be successful, the
second highest court in the land. this suggests to me that jurors should have practical experience and understand what people are up against every day of their lives. >> i remember when driving while black, there were nightly news packages on it, right? >> right. >> how much progress have we made? those were big issues. councilman, how much progress do you think we've made? >> i think being alive while black is still a situation in the country. any time you can look at the color of the skin and decide what kind of education opportunities they are going to have, whether or not they have employment opportunities, it's a problem. and if you know that you're going to be stopped 106 times in new york city, then we know it's a problem. the fact that we call this thing a new york city stop question and frisk, it's a problem. most people just call it police work if it's done properly. so it's a huge problem in new york city, so goes new york city, so goes the rest of the
country. met with the department of justice and went down to d.c., they also expressed much concern that this is going on throughout the country. and as you mentioned, at least at its worst, someone being shot and killed i believe because of the color of their skin when they are unarmed or at the least, going to an event i'm invited to, being arrested and detained for an hour. >> and you were just stopped on the street for no reason? >> i was going to an event that i was invited to with someone else, who works for the public advocate. we were going inside. we showed our credentials to two officers, and the last officer just stopped. i got arrested on the phone. i got on the phone with the chief of police trying to explain to them what was going on. i had my city council pin pen, a big ribbon and i had my badge and none of that mattered. the problem is, they keep saying the gun, the gun violence, the this black on black crime. you get tired of hearing that. i know where the crime is. i go to the funerals. i go talk to the mothers. the problem is, it's not working. so we keep trying to do things that are not working. >> so this is a question about
police work and you worked as a police officer, written about policing, teach about criminal justice. i want to read you -- i want to play for you a sound from ray kelly, responding to the idea that the new york city police are engaged in social profiling take a listen. >> people who -- it's 53% african-american. so really, the perpetrators of crime. the stark reality is crime happens in communities of color. >> that's the argument. what's your response to that? >> the two sides are talking past each other. there is a problem of black on black violence in new york city and other places that needs to be addressed. in a sense kelly is right.
how are police going about what should be doing their job and doing it often without the proper training and to meet quotas. productivity quotas. >> explain that. >> stop, question and frisk, worried about them and because their accounted then police use them to judge police officers work. so ironically, the form they use has probably increased the number of staff infrictions. >> and the wire hitting the numbers. my question is, does this come policy, from interactions on the ground? where do we put the pin on this to make the change? i want to get that this question right after the break. my doctor. my gynecologist. my pharmacist. citracal. citracal. [ female announcer ] you trust your doctor. doctors trust citracal.
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we're back. msnbc political analyst professor georgetown. temperaturing a story, a story that i think almost every black man has. i mean, if ever one i've talked to. >> look. i'm 57 4 yea4 pshgs stopped me brother and a friend said we had stolen a car. i was going to pull out my registration. the policeman call immediate the n word, knocked me on the ground. hit my friend on the ground. ran the registration, saw it was our car, drove off, no apology. >> what year was that? >> this was 1978. let me say this. progress has been made, but malcolm x says you don't stick a knife in my back, pull it out and call it progress. it still hurts. we don't make a distinction, of course black people want the
cops to come but make suitable distinctions between criminals and those who are not. we don't make that distinctions. >> you is ay progress -- >> i like the way chris rock said it. they say they made progress. people stop acting crazy. sometimes you acknowledge the crazy behavior that happens. >> my question, if there is progress made, institutionally. a question how do we get policing to not do profiles. that's the question. right? a whole lot of big questions about race and the criminal justice system. in this microsense if we have made progress, what has made that progress happen and how do we keep it going? >> progress was with what george wilkins did. until the mid-90s, profiling was openly and unofficially practiced. that has changed. >> explain the change. >> in maryland and new jersey, where the lawsuits came out. the cops had a bad profile based on dea agents who asked cops who
they found drugs on. they said on young black men. >> let me say this. you've got kelly saying this. he's saying, we're under profiling people, number one. number two, look at more white people, you'll find more white crime. stop looking at -- >> that's my point. >> that's my whole point. >> and they're not looking at the white people. you said drug was white people. >> the question is stop gun violence. it is gun violence. the problems is, what do we do to get to that? to this date, and throughout our history, over-reliance on enforcement and locking up many black and latino men has been when we're doing and -- this weekend, nypd, opposed to this, came out and responded. one community part. where are the other agencies? the department of mental health? a division of youth community
i involvemei involveme involvement, where are the other resources? we need to change the discussion about what pub lech safelic saf >> and and that and we know alr it's not about logic or reason but investment and identification. >> actually -- but -- >> weapons and -- >> also know that whites and blacks use drugs at the same amounts. >> exactly. >> and the self-reporting of white people they've got more drugs. more disposable income, you got more drugs. >> when you only search one group -- >> this is the important point. if you search -- this is a really important point about the root of this. you search one group pup say that's the group to profile. of course -- >> based on -- >> and suddenly cops feel justified. look, it came out of the dea. they don't know what they're talking about. >> and changing the goal of
increasing the stops. right? first, less drugs. then up until last year, shootings stayed relatively the same. shootings down. relatively the same. murders down, decreased. happy about people getting shotted, that's not effective. >> the argument becomes, this is working. heard this argument, mayor bloomberg. >> the precinctses, no correlation or causation between -- we have precincts -- rnlg to -- >> not only that, monetizing the pa pathology, giving more money to those, monetize what is essentially pathological behavior as opposed to fixing it structurally. that's part of the problem. >> thanks to all of you. great job. thank you very much. that is it for this evening. the "reiachel maddow show" star
now. >> did you say you were having -- be healed. thank you very much, thanks for staying with us for the next hopefully dirt-free hour. you never know. after serving 12 years in the united states senate, senator ben nelson of nebraska left the senate last year, and he founded a lobbying ferre ini. left the senate, now in a lobbying firm. texas senator hutchison, and now senator jon kyl 26 year, left the senate in january to join a lobbying firm. whatever happened to old senator evan berybod evan bayh?